Hi everyone. we are new in this country and bought 2 puppies from a petshop in MA without knowing there is something called 'puppymill'. And I keep getting mean remark from people whenever I asked for advices. If I would to know about puppymills,I wouldnt even step in there.So please help me out to get the right path with my new puppies.

I bought a scottie and a westie on 21 April. The shop fed them with Evolve pet food. When I took them home,I bought a 36" foldable crate.I placed the divider in the central and left a bed in on each side for each of them. But the westie soiled it the first night. And since that day, she kept on pooing soft stool.We were wondering how come she can poo nonstop and then eat them all up. But the scottie was never once soiling the crate.

I brought them to the vet immediately after I bought them and all was went,fecal check was no parasite too and they received a shot in distemper,parvo,parainfluenze,lapto and a shot of lyme 3 days later.And I also gave them heartguard 3 days after I got them.

I mixed the evolve with eukanuba lamb and rice for 3-4 days before I started giving eukanuba.The scottie was doing very well and became so chubby but the westie still keep on pooing and eating the pooh.I brought her to the vet on 28April and he suspected pancreatic insufficiency but the test showed negative.She lost from 5.5lbs to 5.2lbs in a week.

I need help here. Since the scottie seems to pick up the bad habit from the westie. She also poo inside her crate (but she doesnt eat it up)... I m feeling so helpless here. I feed them 3 times a day,placed newspaper outside their crate. I sit there with them when they eat,make sure they pee and poo before I put them back in.And release them out in 2 hrs and play with them,let them drink water and see them poo and pee and I will put them in again for another 2 hrs... a few times they even poo inside the crate during day.And now they both poo inside the crate everynight!!

Please someone advice me what should I do..

Hi

I'm not an expert but I dont understand why they are spending so much time in a crate - dont think that can be suiting them. 

If it was me with two puppies I would be letting them play and mix with each other and taking them into the garden for toilet training every hour or so and also after waking up and eating.  Every time they go outdoors I would reward them with a big fuss and a treat.

I can only think that they have spent a lot of time trapped in crates and had no choice but to soil them so this is a habit you will have to break but if you keep them in a crate so much it wont really seem any different to them so they will continue to do what they have been.

From a food point of view I would put them on to a good quality food and keep them on it their tummies ought to settle down - puppies/dogs can often have an upset tummy when they first move somewhere new - but you should see an improvement as they start to feel happier and more settled.

Hopefully you will have other people come along with advice

 

Firstly you should never have bought 2 puppies at the same time as you are clearly inexperienced with animals.  Secondly why do you want them locked in a crate?  Dogs are not birds. 

Please re read this post yourself and pretend you were outside the situation and see if you can see what I am saying.

The scottie hasn't picked up any bad habit from the westie it is the way you are keeping them in my opinion that is all wrong.   Why are they not going outside to toliet?

They are being crated all night then for repeated 2 hour intervals during the day.. come on surely you can see what you are doing is all wrong.  

This may come very unwelcome but my personal advise would be to consider your situation carefully.

Hi and Welcome.

It is very hard to bring up two young pups at the same time, and can get quite stressful (so I am told!).

I would suggest getting some anti dog spray to clean the crate out when they have been to toilet in it, this may deter them from doing it in the cage.

If they are young pups, then they will not be able to hold their toilet as well as an adult dog, and will need to be shown where the proper place to do it is, and on a regular basis, i.e. after breakfast, lunch, dinner, playing, sleep etc:
If you keep this up as a routine and go out in the garden with them and praise them when they do their toilet outside they will soon get the hang of it!! patients is needed when bringing up pups.

As for the poo eating, I have not really experienced this with my dogs, but maybe she is lacking something in her diet? or it is maybe just a bad habit she has picked up from where ever she came from?  picking the poo up as soon as she has done it, and or maybe sprinkle some pepper on the fresh poo to put her off?  I am sure someone will give you better advise on here for the poo eating!!

Being young pups they do need rest, and at night time being young will not be able to wait until the morning for a toilet, so taking them out into the garden before you go to bed making sure they do their toilet and then put them to bed, if they cry at night, take them back outside, but dont talk to them until they do their toilet in the garden then praise them. then put them straight back to bed again.

Hope this helps, and enjoy your pups

EDIT: sorry missed that bit about crating for long periods, I agree with BLUE they should not be caged up they need play and company to help them learn and be loving companions
xx

Hmm only thing I find strange here is putting pepper on poo - surely if you have time to do that you have time to remove it completely....is there an advantage to 'putting them off it'?

Dogs are not Rabbits and should not be kept in cages.  Crates are for use for brief periods when you cannot directly supervise, for travel, and for sleeping.

They need training to be clean.  Pups coming from Puppy Farm/Mill situations will have been bred in an environment that is overcrowded and they will have not had the opportunity to form clean habits.  This will affect some pups worse than others.

A puppy born in optimum environment by the time it can stand would walk away from it's nesting and sleeping area to toilet, until then it's mother will eat the faeces and urine to keep the nest clean.

Born in a tiny cage where it's Mum will spend her life the pups will have had no way to do this, and the mother would b e forced to keep cleaning up the poo, and pups will have learnt this habit too.

The puppies should be fed four times a day until 3 months old and then 3 times until about 6 months and then twice a day until a year of age, when you can drop to once a day if you wish.

Puppies need an awful lot of time spent to teach them what they should and should not do.

With specific regard to toilet training.  the more often they make mistakes (poo indoors, or worse their beds) the longer it will take.

For a few weeks you need to watch pups like a hawk and take them out (not put them out) to toilet every hour at least while awake.  Also after eating, waking up, drinking or any excitement/play.

At night you should expect to get up at least every four hours to take pups out for toileting (individually so they don't begin to play, and get distracted).  A puppy will normally not have full bladder control (as in being able to hold on for any length of time once they need to go) until around five months of age, so they really need someone to show them where to go and give e them ample opportunity.

Because you have allowed them to soil their beds (crate) you may have to break that habit by removing it for a while or being extra vigilant and take them out even more often at night to break this habit.

It was a very bad idea to buy two puppies as they will bond more with each other (being same species) and you will become less important/relevant to them.  As you have noticed they will also pick up bad habits from each other as they have no-one to set a good example.  Also there will be the breeding issue if oppostie sexes, or possibly fighting when mature if the same sex as there will not be a clear cut hierachy with both being same age.

You will need to find time to train and spend time with each one individually as well as together, so basically three times the work of one puppy.

An excellent book for the new puppy owner is 'The Perfect Puppy' by Gwen Bailey, adn you can purchse it on Amazon.

MW184, yes I do understand where you are coming from, I personally would pick the poo up before pup had a chance to eat it!!!
But I sure I read somewhere on here, to stop the habit, is to put pepper on the poo and when the dog goes to eat it hates the smell and taste and never does it again???!!!  never tried it with my dogs myself as they don't eat poo!!!!!

Hi,
I it very hard house training two puppies at once, unless you are very experienced!

I take it you didn't do your research and bought these puppies from a puppy farm, this is probably your problem. In these places they are badly socialised and badly looked after and often taken from Mum far too early to be sold.
Did you see the parents and were they house trained? Were the puppies using news paper at the puppymill?

First how old are these puppies? Puppies can not control bladder and bowels till 16 weeks old. I'm tring to guess how old they are, puppies should go at about 8 weeks, you have had them one week, so are they 9 weeks old - they should be on 4 meals a day of good quality, soaked puppy food. They will need worming at 10 and 12 weeks.

Yes I crate, but only over night only, with vet bed and news paper. You need to be there and have them loose during the day, taking them out every hour, and praiseing them when they get it right and go outside.
Black Pepper does work.
At the moment I have a 15 week old and 11 week old to train it's hard work.
You need to have alot of time and patience.

Gemini05 - thank god I have never had to deal with that either!!  Mind you that thought alone could put me off ever having a puppy...



Chrisy if you look at the post again OP says they definitely came from a puppy mill she just didnt realise at the time these types of places exist and is now suffering the consequences...

Am I right in thinking you're in the US? Unfortunately keeping dogs and puppies crated for long periods is more acceptable than it is in this country (this is a UK-based forum), so you're likely to get some strong reactions about it.

If you follow the advice given by 'Brainless' (a misnomer if ever there was one) you'll have the best chance of ending up with happy, healthy pets.

Also, if the pups are only 12 weeks or so old, they should be on 4 meals.

I think if the pups were not crated for such a huge part of the day they would not poo in the crate because they wouldnt need to. Simple as.
Seems such a shame they are crated so much...why is that? If you around to let them out at 2 hour intervals why dont you have them around you and let them out every half and hour to an hour for toilet outside?

>I sit there with them when they eat,make sure they pee and poo before I put them back in.And release them out in 2 hrs and play with them,let them drink water and see them poo and pee and I will put them in again for another 2 hrs... a few times they even poo inside the crate during day.And now they both poo inside the crate everynight!!

Puppies shouldn't be crated for longer than half an hour to an hour at a time, then they need to be taken out into the garden to learn to pee and poo out there. They simply can't last as long as two hours at this age, and when they need to go, they'll go where they are, unless the owner watches them very carefully for the little signs of discomfort - the trotting about, sniffing the floor, maybe a little whimper - and calls them out into the garden.

House-training is hard work, and very much a full-time job. The more pro-active effort put in by the owner, the quicker it'll happen.

To house train a puppy i have always kept it (i've only had one) close by, then every time it looks like circling smelling to poo or pee, pick it up, run outside, and praise its wonderful performance outside. As they need to poo and pee within a short time of eating, i would take them out anyway at that time, and also when they first wake up, and just stay outside until they perform. I found it easier to keep a close eye on my pup by keeping him on a lead which was tied to my belt, so he didn't quietly slip away to do his poo in a corner.
Also any messes inside must be cleaned away immediately, and the area thoroughly washed down with a proprietary dog accident cleaner, or non-bio detergent and vinegar, as discussed by others on here, do not use ordinary household cleaners as they contain bleach and encourage dogs to go there.
Good luck.

I didnt know this is a UK forum but I m alright with strong reaction. I rather to get learned than to be fooled by people who just try to make fun of each other.

Yes,I just moved to the US. The reason i got 2 puppies was, I thought they could keep each other accompany when human friend werent able to be there with them 24hrs. I consulted a vet here before going for 2,instead of 1.

And the reason I got them a crate is also advice given by breeders and vets that to crate train them is the best way to housebreak them and I also read it on alot of websites. I didnt know its bad..

I would usually sit there with them to make sure they finished each food and to pick them up and bring them to the paper whenever they sniff the ground but the westie can hold for so long and refuse to do it when i placed her on the paper and would do it on the floor whenever i walk away.

The reason I didnt let them out in the yard was, I thought its best for them to complete all shots before letting them out?

Unfortunately in the US things are extremely different than here in the UK.  For one, many of your gardens are not secure, the majority of ours here in the UK are so we start taking them outside in the garden straight away.  I also realise that in the US many people crate their dogs for most of the day and of course at night, that really doesn't happen here in the UK.

Most of us would not advise people to have 2 pups at the same time, it's a lot of hard work with one never mind two.

PLEASE EVERYBODY GIVE THIS OP CONSTRUCTIVE ADVICE RATHER THAN HAVE A GO.  I know that most of us will anyway but please remember different countries do things differently.  It may not be the way that many of us would do things of course.

I think most will happily give the poster advice seeing as she has came back with an open mind.

One thing I will say though Perrodeagua I personally dont give a hoot what an another country does  as that doesn't make it acceptable.  The country I live has a high volume of excessive drinkers but it doesn't mean I think it acceptable to behave the same way.  

I disagree with you when you say a lot of gardens are not secure that is not my experience of either the US or Canada only in the holiday favorite areas where houses are built for the rental market. 

Tazmanica74

I am really glad you have came back with a open mind. I felt a little sick reading your initial post.

Get your garden 100% secure. Including right along the bottom. Chicken wire it if neccessary.  Get on your hands and knees and double and tripe check it is safe.

Once that is done forget the paper for good. Get the puppies out ever hour on the hour to the same spot in the garden. When the do something cheer and praise the puppy. They quickly get the idea.

The crate is fine for very very occasional use. If you decide to use it at night be prepared to get up and let them out to the toliet for 15 mins minimum. Take them straight outside after feeding and then again in 30 mins rather than the every hour in between feeds as one digested they generally need out again quite quickly.

If no other animal has access to your yard your puppies will be save. I am guessing though they have now had all their shots or have I picked that up wrong.

There are many of us on this link who use crates, but the point of a crate is to give them a safe place where they can be left for a short time and not get into danger while no-one is around, and it doubles up as a bed. Usually the crate is left open for access during the day. A crate is not a way around house-training. The pups will usually want to pee/poo when they wake up: when they have eaten and lots of time in between. The only sure way is to take them in the yard after each nap and meal and every 90 minutes or so all the time they are awake. Lots of praise when they toilet. And as well as 4 meals a day, they should have free access to water all the time - not just with meals.  

Can you take them outside on lead somewhere if you haven't got a secure garden? Somewhere that other dogs don't go is best, you are quite right about not mixing with other dogs until they have completed their shots, although vaccinated dogs should be safe. But if you have a patch of land outside your door where unvaccinated dogs can't just wander in, that should be safe enough. Then like others have said, take them out, let them wee and poo, then they should be safe to run around and play for a bit before they need to go again! Once they are tired from playing, take them out again to toilet, then if you need to do something and can't watch them, you can either crate them for a short time, or put them in a puppy proof room or pen that is easily cleaned in case of accidents.

My breeder told me also to get a cage for my puppy. All the advice you have been given by people, you generally assume they know more than you, but it can cause a lot confusion.
I never did buy a cage for my pup as I find them cruel period. I would forget about it for a while put it in the garage and let the pups live in the kitchen then your carpets aren't ruined and follow all the good advice from this lot.
Well surprised that a vet said get 2 at the same age but good news you have 2 very different dogs character wise I bet the westie will be boss but usually its the bitch and not the dog when ever you have 2 together.
From there sad beginnings they can only go up and they can become a proper member of your family.
Are they boy's or girls or both ?

Lets start from basics, I have two pups about 8 weeks in age difference and I got over it! First crates are great but only if used responsibly. I have two crates, first, when puppies I put a bed in half and left half as a play area overnight only. During the day the boys were with us and if they looked like having a wee or pooh I took them outside.
I was lucky apart frtom an odd accident the crates were clean. To clean them I used disenfectant spray from Pet City and a hose pipe outside.
Luckily we had space to make a secure pen and the kitchen door was left open so they were never confined in doors. Bed time was "outside hurry up" or whatever phase you want to use. With patience we got there but it will take months not weeks. They are walked twice a day and you build that up in 30 minutes per month (yes?)
Pick up pooh as soon as you can, goes for outside as well.
Food, both mine eat different foods, they are different breeds and try as I did all I did was upset one's tummy. Keep treats at a minimum whilst one is bad, always give access to clean water.
And my two do keep each other company, and one's a border and ones a spaniel.
Now at 13 & 15 months they are my joy!
I do not know how it works in USA but dogs are dogs. Mine went only into the garden until they had the second injection then out properly and you can mix dopgs if you are very sure that the other dog has had its injections.
Eating pooh never had that but I guess you might find a thread some where, I think they will get over it in time.
Just don't fret and have fun with the pups. One thing i did find is that training is better done apart they just (like kids) muck about when together!  Since we split them to train its so much better.

And good luck, keep in touch.

I know some people on here do paper train their puppies but I tend to be of the opinion that it is harder to housetrain them using this method. The eventual aim of housetraining is to teach them not to go indoors. With paper training you have to teach them twice over - initially you teach them that it is alright to go on the paper indoors but, unless you want to use this method all their lives, you will eventually have to teach them to go outside so I prefer to take them outside from the very first day they come to live with me.

That can be difficult if you don't have a place free from other dogs that might not have been vaccinated but maybe you could have an area outdoors that you could just keep for your puppies?

> we are new in this country and bought 2 puppies from a petshop in MA without knowing there is something called 'puppymill'.

How silly do I feel!
I read this you were new to England and bought your puppies from a well know place in MA ( Manchester).
Do I feel a fool.

I crate train all mine and advice new owners to do the same. I advice using the crate as the puppies new den a place to rest a place to sleep. Cover the crate with a blanket. Using it only over night and if your out for a short time. I take mine out side every hour, in my own secure garden.
Use the crate to feed them and to let them sleep, but encourage them to ppe and poo outside.
Good Luck and be patient - it takes weeks.

>The reason i got 2 puppies was, I thought they could keep each other accompany when human friend werent able to be there with them 24hrs. I consulted a vet here before going for 2,instead of 1.

Reputable behaviourists here will tell you that, with two puppies at the same time, for every 5 minutes they spend playing together they each need to spend 15 minutes apart, playing with their owners, to get the dog/human bond as close as the dog/dog bond. They each need to be trained separately as well as being trained together; walked separately as well as being walked together: two puppies isn't double the work, it's more like the work squared.

>The reason I didnt let them out in the yard was, I thought its best for them to complete all shots before letting them out?

As long as your yard is secure from other dogs who might not be vaccinated, it's safe for the puppies to go out there. Teaching them to use paper only teaches them that it's acceptable to pee and poo indoors, meaning that hey need to unlearn that and start again later on.

Please don't feel to blame for their behaviour - we all learn by our mistakes, and we're all here to help you and your puppies as much as we can.

> Hmm only thing I find strange here is putting pepper on poo - surely if you have time to do that you have time to remove it completely....is there an advantage to 'putting them off it'?

"UGH! that tastes nasty!" is the aim. if it doesn;t taste good anymore they won;t eat it. simply casue you can;t always get there before the pup

you've clearly realised the mistakes you've made tamanica and are trying to fix them, so good for you for that.

> The reason i got 2 puppies was, I thought they could keep each other accompany

a lot of folk tink this and yes they do, but thats a bad thing!! consider how much more trouble two kids together can be than just one child? they egg each other on and such and don;t concentrate on you. when this is applied to pups that makes training harder. it's not insurmountable though, just will take hard work

crate training is a great thing, we've always done it, but it's a little goes a long way type of thing. the pup should end up thinking of the crate as their safe and quiet time out place. short period and sleep time only, not prolonged use. dogs are very very high maintenance and need to be around you as much as possible to be at their best.

as to the shots, only a prob if other dogs are in your garden.  

Hi thanks for everyone. I appreciate all your kind advice. Its better than the US forum that just shoot and blame me on things I learned from them.

I think my yard is secured cos its fenced.I probably wouldnt let them out without me keeping an eye of them.I just bought 2 leash so I m going to start bringing them out before meals,after meals and every hour BUT how do we do about in the night?

When I bought them from the petshop,the owner gave me a list of shots they have taken but my vet told me those are just the temporary shots breeders give to their pups and he suggested to redo all shots.So they only have their first shot of distemper,parvo,parainfluenze,lepto and lyme on 21 april.and a tablet of heartguard on 24 april. That was why I was hesitated about bringing them out But I think my yard is safe cos I probably going to let them at one corner,and not the whole yard.

I tried all I could to stop her from eating the poo.Well I cant be there 24hrs. But I always sit there with them during meals to make sure they dont eat other's food.And I would stay there for at least half hour trying to pick them up and bring them to the paper to pee and poo after meals.The westie is super stubborn and refused to do it on the paper.she would do it everywhere but not the paper.And I would pick up the poo first thing but I still catch her eating poo. I got some powder form things from the vet to be added to the food to make the food taste disgusting so she would stop but she still eats it...

I bought the odour cleaning spray and have clean up the crate,their cushioned bed and I removed the door so they can use it for just sleeping place.

One more thing I need your advice. I gave them heartguard on 24 april and the scottie have a few days of blood stain on the soft stool. What happened? Is this normal?

Can someone tell me why is their stool so soft? I bought another brand of dog food from the shop today. The sales lady told me its a natural food and the best in US.The brand is Praire.. anyone heard about it?

Look.I dont want to start being girly but I really appreciate all the advices that I m getting here.

Opps,I forgot to answer one of them. Both the westie and the scottie are girls..

You'll either have to get up in the night for a few weeks, or put up with them messing their crates I'm afraid. With the food, it's best to decide on one brand and stick to it, puppies have very delicate tummies and the stress of moving to a new home is enough to upset them without changing food every few days. I don't know about any of the brands you've tried though I'm afraid. My boy eats other dogs poo which he scavenges in the park, so at least eating her own poo you can make sure they are wormed so it's safe if disgusting!! :rolleyes:

Night time if yoru going to crate you need to get up and take them quietly outside.  do not talk to them other than to say be busy (or whatever command you will use for tehm to toilet).

If you are going to leave them free in an area with washable floor, then some paper by the back door might encourage them to go there, but it will prolong the training period.

I find it very practical to fence off (making up or buying galvanised weldmesh panels) part of the garden that the pups can have safe access to.

this allows you to keep the rest of your yard poop free, grow flowers etc.  Of course when your in the garden/yard with them you can let them in the rest of the yard supervised.

This means, especially if you have children visit or living with you, that you are not worrying about them trailing poopy shoes into the house and controls the play between them and the pups to supervised only avoiding mishaps due to over excitement.

Also on wet days it is handy that the area the dogs access is paved or gravelled to make life easier for you with dirt and mud being tracked into the house.

The reason I suggest Weldmesh is it is easy to buy ready made panels that bolt together in various heights and lengths, or if your handy you can make up your own panels using Weldmesh (at least 10gauge, not chicken wire), which can be fixed together where you want them, and eventually even taken down.  they are not intrusive in the way solid or picket partitions would be.

about the poo eating, i think someone on here before had the same prob and folk suggested putting pineapple jusice in with their dinner as it makes the poo taste yucky. not sure its a great idea right now if their stools are still soft.

since their both girls you;d better be warned in advance...as they get older there might be a bit of bickering (not for quite a while yet) but they will want to establish who's boss.

Do you mean make a 'dog run' with weldmesh and leave them outside? would it serve the purpose of them knowing that is toilet?
I brought them on a leash one by one this morning, so far so good. It took them almost 10mins to poo and I gave them a treat and alot of praises.I will do it again in 30 mins time again.

I wouldn't just leave them to it out there at first, as otherwise you won't be able to praise them for their efforts, as you won't be there when they perform.
Once they know what to do you could let them out on their own for a short while, but i wouldn't leave them out there alone at this stage.

reeces right, its the praising thats important. basically your pups will eat priase from you, it's all they really want (or food ) and when you praise them (has to be immediately after they've done the right thing) they equalte that action (pooing outside) with nice things happening. pavlov did some good work

.> Do you mean make a 'dog run' with weldmesh and leave them outside

No a dog safe area that they can use where you can let them play and toilet of lead, here it will be easy to find and dispose of their toilet efficiently (will help with the poo eating).

You will find that they probably won't need the toilet much in the night, we used to take our pup out in the garden about 11pm, and she went till about 4am from the start, by 3 or 4 months she was going all night.

Theres no future in shouting at you, you didnt know you had made a mistake - Id love to shout at the vet who told you to get two puppies and who didnt help you find the right place to buy from though.

Right there is lesson one - vets do NOT offer good advice on a number of things, including where to buy a pup, how to train a pup, how to solve behavioural problems... vets treat ill animals. End of.

When you are home, during the day: Puppies with you in whichever room you are in. Watch them closely, any sign of circling, sniffing about looking like they may toilet, and off you go outside.

Keep treats in your pockets at all times and when a pup goes in the right place, praise and give a treat. This will mean puppy will WANT to go in that place again, with you there to see - so you are not only teaching where is right to go, but also setting up the beginnings of puppy learning to wait until you are there to let them out. (if you arent there, then no treat, so puppy wants you to be there).

When you are home, asleep - put the crate in your bedroom. You will then wake when a pup wakes, and can take them straight outside. No need for them to learn to cry for you and you should be able to stop them going in the crate.

Because you are treating for going outside, puppy will be wanting his/her treat and is less likely to eat her mess.

The mess eating is in all likelyhood twofold - 1/ in a petshop, spending all her time crated, she messes in the crate and her options are to lie in her own mess, or clean it up. 2/Fed on low quality food that is full of grains, colourings, flavourings, sugars, poo will still be pretty tasty to a pup.

The problem now is that it has become a habit which you need to break. Stopping crating except at night time will help, teaching to go in the right place for a reward will help.

Feeding a higher quality food that contains less rubbish will also help, and I would probably add pineapple to their meals (just a little crushed pineapple), as that apparently makes the poo taste foul and they dont want to eat it. YOu MUST stop the crating and teach pup to go in the right place as wel though, just making the poo taste foul will not work and would be deeply unkind - she is doing this for a reason.

If her poos are runny then the food is not agreeing - it may well be that one brand suits one dog but doesnt suit another.

I cant recommend a brand as I feed raw meat and bones.

Finally: yes, they will be company for one another, but they must be taught how to cope alone from each other, and to respond to YOU in preference to one another. This means you must train each one seperately, AND then train both together so that they have a strong bond with you.

Have a look round the internet for clicker training, its a great way to build up a dogs confidence in you and in himself.

I have started my garden training but its not so successful but I m not giving up since its only day one.

I have forgotten the crate as I have removed the door to make free entry for them to go inside their bed.

I took them out for 20mins. Its probably new for them and they dont do anything right away but its really cold outside and its raining so its not easy.

Both poo outside and when I brought them inside,10mins after,they peed on the paper...well...I guess I still should be happy at least they are not doing on the floor.

The stool is much better today cos I took the advice to add rice inside.Just a teaspoon of rice into each bowl.

I bought clicker also and do individual training.I cant handle training both cos they are too busy jumping with each other for my attention.Now they are able to sit and down when they are 1 to 1.

I m happy that I m getting alot of advices from all you kind people here.Please be patient with me as I m most likely to learn.

Great start.  The more you ask before problems get established the less likely they are to become bad habits.

You're doing great! Take it one day at a time, and train them individually, one puppy at a time (although with two you have to do both each day, so there's much more work involved).

Each poo or pee outdoors is a step in the right direction. Each poo or pee indoors is a pause in the advance. But you'll all get there in the end.

Excellent progress with your puppies !!

All the time you put in for the FIRST 6 months will be so much easier than when they hit 18 months!

Best of luck. Keep us posted on all your hard work.

Pups sometimes dont realise they need to go again, so after they go, and you come inside, keep a really close eye on them and nip them back outside if they need to go.

If either makes a real habit of going outside to toilet, then coming back ina dn going again inside, get one step ahead of the game. Bring them back in as normal, but then after just a minute, take them back outside again!

The more wees and poos they do outside the better and faster they will learn.

Hi everyone

winter,the westie.Her poo is now much more form when I added a teaspoon of rice into her food.I will stop from now on to prevent her constipation but summer,the scottie is still having loose stool with blood stain in it. She doesnt looks like she is ill or what. So active and so attention seeking and appetite normal so I really dont know what is wrong with her. How could she be having this loose stool and blood stain thing since I gave her the heartguard?

I told my husband to keep away the foldable crate and we would put their bed inside the travel carrier for them to sleep in.I think they probably hated the crate since I started wrongly with it.

ok,I will update daily.Time to go out but I hate the weather cos it has been raining since Friday...need to go petshop to get them the raincoat..

Love the names! It's possible Summer is still getting over all the food switching, if the vet has seen them and wormed them which I think you said earlier, and if she's happy in herself, it shouldn't be anything too serious, but if it continues might be worth going back to the vet. Resist attempts to change to yet another food, specially one of the super-expensive ones the vets love to sell you! Re the crate, if they are happier in their bed no need to worry, but it is possible to re-introduce the crate later with treats, Kongs etc in it so they realise it's a fun place to be, not a prison - dogs naturally do like to have dens. Our dogs often snooze in crates if we have one set up around the house, but most of the time they stick with our laps or the sofas, lol!

I think I have to bring summer back to the vet tomorrow cos although she is eating well and active and happy.I feel incomfortable seeing blood in every poo she made.I m getting worried.Cos I have given probiotic that suppose to regenerate the digestive system as well as kaolin to stop the loose stool.It doesnt seem to help at all.

I removed all crates and use the carriers only when I m cleaning up their 'space'. But they are carrying their beds everywhere like its a RV for them haha

It will take time for their digestive systems to recover - they haven't had the best of starts in life with so many changes of environment from breeder to shop to you, no doubt with changes of food and drinking water each time (that's not your fault at all!) and then injections and worming on top, so will need careful management for some time to get them on an even keel.

JG would you advise chicken & rice? I assume you shouldn't starve for 24 hours like you would with an adult?

>JG would you advise chicken & rice? I assume you shouldn't starve for 24 hours like you would with an adult? 

That's an impossible question! One vet I've worked with advised that a 24-hour fast would do a pup no harm. Another equally-qualified vet said that it would be wrong.

On balance I'd aim for a middle course. Starve (in respect of no food) for 12 hours, but making sure plenty of liquid (not milk) was taken. Then I'd give small portions of boiled chicken or white fish with very over-boiled rice (far too stodgy to serve to people - all the grains must stick together) every 3 hours, for about 48 hours, then gradually reintroduce the regular diet.

I gave summer chicken and rice today also. I dont know what to do with her loose stool with blood in it.Its almost a week now.

She may have colitis which is basically inflammation and irritation of the gut lining. Pop your dog to the vets, often a tablet and an injection is all that is needed. Our pup had this, we stopped all dog food ( and treats ) for three days and just fed boiled chicken breast and stodgy rice...it gives the tummy time to settle. We found other chicken meat upset his tum too..Slowly we introduced his dog food again and he was fine.
Don't overfeed either.