I havent had any problems with allergies before. Maybe I have been lucky but my youngest TT (two in Feb) has had a constantly itchy bottom for the last couple of months, plus strong biting of back paws until sore. (had to have steroid injection and on antibiotics for a torn pad at the moment) She cant seem to leave her bottom/paws alone. I have done the usual stuff. Wormed and anal glands emptied, although they didnt have much in them. I did change her food when all this started, just to see if it would make a difference, from JWB to CJS that'll do, although the latter is wheat based. She doesnt have any problem like sickness or dihorrea. Her pooh is good and firm. Does any of this point to wheat please?

Skin problems and itching are frequently food related.  I've seen raw feeding make the best improvement followed by Wafcol Salmon & Potato or Walcol Vegetarian.

It could well be a food related problem. If she was mine, I'd eliminate grains completely (it often isn't just wheat - could be maize, rice etc) by either going the raw route or feeding a high quality grain-free food such as Orijen.

Right, I did mention the food thing to the vet but he didnt think it was food related but am definitely going to go along that road as the usual basic things we have tried, havent worked. Thank-you

> Wafcol Salmon & Potato

Just looked that one up and it seems reasonably priced. (Price is an issue for me being a pensioner!!!!) Havent checked Orijen out yet but will do. I think CJS do a fish based food. I wonder if that one would be ok. Just realized, have been giving her weetabix in a morning to help bulk up her stools. Doh!!! Possibly wheat based lol. Poor girl, didnt stand a chance!!!

Id say its the weetabix. If your dog was fine before the weetabix just stop that. I used wafcol chicken and corn for a westie with skin probs.
Jean

Just wondering though, if it is a food allergy, why is she not scratching her skin or chewing front paws?? As I said in the original post, I have no experience at all with allergies, so need to sort it out in my own mind as I try to help her.

Hi I have a TT Safi, who has allergies to just about everything. she also suffers from colitis quite badly :O(
Sadly I bred her and I would never, ever breed form her in case it got passed on. her mum can tolerate anything! So its not got passed down from her. She's 12 now and is fit as a lop!

Safi def. doesn't cope with any grains! Also a lot of meats!! And also dairy products!
She seems to tolerate fish as good as anything so I tend to feed her the Wafcol salmon & potato or Wainwrights (PAH)  S & P along with Hills z/d prescription diet. Complete & tins. You don't have to buy this from the vet. Online pet chemists are a lot cheaper. ie Medicanimal or Canine Chemist are 2 of them. some folk recommend Chappie but due to the rice content I can't give her that. but you might be able to.
CJS also do a salmon complete which she can cope with in small amounts.
I would try and avoid using the steroids if possible
I did feed raw a while ago for about 2 years but even that didn't suit her in the end. she ended up with a bad dose of campylobactor probably caused by raw chicken. Hasn't been able to cope with it since
she has had this issue since I began weaning her at 3-4 weeks so I think with her its a definate low immune sysytem. I try to build this up but again its difficult when she reacts to so many different things.
a little tip: Check her gums to see if they are swollen. that is one of the first things I look for with mine if she's had something slightly different as they swell up. Its a sure sign that something hasn't agreed with her!
Good luck with your 'Little Person' I hope you find a solution. If you do give me the secret!!!!! ;O)
Anne

Just another thought. She has had her anal glands emptied, hasn't she?? That would cause her to bite at her bott. Check them to see if all is well in that department.
Anne x

sorry Andee, havent been able to "Do" the forum for a few days. The anal glands thing. She had them emptied and the day after was biting again. I put that down to feeling a bit uncomfortable but sit didnt stop. Had them checked again and there wasnt much in, nothing in one, but still biting. She seems to do it just before she has a pooh!! As I mentioned before, she doenst have any tummy problems, only bites her bum and back paws and very rarely scratches so am a bit confused about the allergy thing. Wondering if it is just her anal glands causing the problem which in turn would make her bit her back paws?
So mixed up!!!! Will go down the no grain route though and see what happens. thank-you.x

> As I mentioned before, she doenst have any tummy problems, only bites her bum and back paws and very rarely scratches so am a bit confused about the allergy thing.

Food ALLERGIES cause itching and skin problems, food INTOLLERANCES cause tummy upset.

"The symptoms of food allergies are similar to those of most allergies seen in dogs and cats. The primary symptom is itchy skin affecting primarily the face, feet, ears, forelegs, armpits and the area around the anus. Symptoms may also include chronic or recurrent ear infections, hair loss, excessive scratching, hot spots, and skin infections that respond to antibiotics but reoccur after antibiotics are discontinued." (taken from here )

My last dog had a food allergy (to chicken), his would show as ear problems (only the ONE ear) and would only show as generalised ithcing if he was really bad with it (ie ate a bowl of chicken). My sisters Boxer has a food allergy (liver is one of the culprits, I can't recall the others), she bites all 4 feet and scratches her face - the itchy/problem areas can be different in dog to dog.

> Food ALLERGIES cause itching and skin problems, food INTOLLERANCES cause tummy upset.
>

Ah, thank-you so much Mastifflover. That makes things much clearer. (The light has gone on!! lol) Thank-you for the link. Its just with my vet saying it isnt allergy (although third time this year has had sore paw chewing problems) and me, being the dog's owner, convinced that it was more than coincidence, my head was spinning. I did look at some stuff about allergies on 't tinternet but nothing as clear and easy to read as the link you have give me. Very grateful. Thank-you.

I hope you get it sorted out, it's horrible seeing them stressed out with itching/biting thierselfs and not knowing what to do about it. Fingers crossed you can pin-point the problem food quickly

When my last dog kept getting ear infections the vet didn't seem convinced food could have anythong to do with it, so I monitored the ingredients lables on everything he ate (I didn't know about the 'exclusion diet'), I identified chicken as the problem very quickly and once that was kept out of his diet - no more ear problems The only problem we had was if he ate a bit of chicken that had been dropped by the kids/cat, within 2 hours he would be rubbing his face along the floor, trying to itch his ear

Best of luck
xx

Thank-you so much. I feel much more positive now. I suppose I have tended to listen to vets and take their word as law but this time, it just didnt seem right. Luckily, my girl's problem doesnt seem to be a major one and maybe that is where the fine line is. Maybe if she was scratching all over and in severe distress, then the vet would probably take allergy into consideration. Day one of getting her sorted now. Thank-you so much. Will let you know how things go. x

Just a quickie. Had a look at the exclusion diet thing. Am just feeding salmon and potato but its the treats thing. Very difficult to leave out treats altogether as there are lots of circumstances when I use them. Wondered if carrots would be ok? They would be fine with carrots for treats.

> Wondered if carrots would be ok? They would be fine with carrots for treats.

Would have thought that carrots would be fine, there's not a lot to them really and not alot of a raw carrot actually gets digested any way does it ? (judging by the fact it generally comes out much the same as it goes in!). If there is anyway of using her food as treats that would be great. Ie. if the salmon & potato is kibble, you could use that kibble as treats, may be 'higher value' than carrots

You could try treats from Fish4Dogs. They have purely fish based treats without any other ingredients.

> not alot of a raw carrot actually gets digested any way does it ? (judging by the fact it generally comes out much the same as it goes in!).
true lol

> You could try treats from Fish4Dogs

ah, will have a look at those. thank-you.

Annieg3 have you had any blood tested for allergies?

It could be a contact or inhaled allergy too, inside or outside the home. Alot of dogs are allergic to things like house dust and storage mites (which are in dry food) or something like grass or pollens outside the home. 

Annieg3 have you had any blood tested for allergies?

Hi Justine, No, but I have been thinking about that, although in the info that Mastifflover pointed me to, they are saying that blood tests are "of no merit" in the diagnosis of food allergies. Obviously your point is that it might not be food and could be some sort of external allergen. Mmm. I think I must go down that road too, just to eliminate those. No point changing diet if it is some sort of external thing. Thank-you.
Any idea of how much a vet would charge for that?

No point changing diet if it is some sort of external thing.
Think I would attack it from the opposite direction!  Changing the food to a better diet is a relatively simple and cheap thing to do and not invasive for the dog.  Veterinary testing is something that I would only do if the basic (and the most common) thing didn't work.

Yes I think the same as Westcoast, starting from the inside wont hurt!

I think a York test is what you need with your bloods. Good luck with it though.  Skin can be a minefield.   Failing that, if your vet is still reluctant to do further tests, I'd ask for a referral to a Dermatologist.

> Think I would attack it from the opposite direction

Right, I do appreciate hearing from all sides as, in original post, I have no experience of allergies in dogs before. Have started on the diet thing so will carry on with that now. Found a local stockist for Fish4dogs so they will be good for treats as well as the salmon and potato kibble. Thank you peeps!!

Hope you get the allergy problems sorted. Be aware that chicken based foods can also cause problems for some dogs. All ours are on Salmon and Potato foods without any problems (although luckily we haven't had any allergy issues). Just be very aware with other flavours of food that they are species specific - often with the likes of the Salmon/Lamb foods, further down the ingredients list they actually contain chicken meal. The food we use is hypoallergenic and species specific so you only have one animal protein source.

Good luck

Alex

> Be aware that chicken based foods can also cause problems for some dogs.

Yes, was looking at ingredients on packets yesterday and did spot chicken very low on the lists. You have to be so careful, dont you. I suppose you do get used to it. Am using Walfcol salmon and potato at the moment but will have a look at CSJ products later as I think they do one which is a bit cheaper but will have to check those ingredients!!! Thank-you

Would Burns be worth a try? I bought a bag some time a go for one of mine, they eat it for a little while and did well

> Would Burns be worth a try

Ah, interesting. When I found a supplier of Fish4dogs treats, the owner gave me a booklet on Burns but with christmas etc. havent had time to read it. Will have a look at that soon. Thank-you.

Hi Annieg3. Best wishes for the new year!

It can be quite hard to get hold of from pet stores, PAH do not stock it as burns can't meet there demands on it, but know that wilsons or just for pets or whtever else they are now calling themselfs stock it! Lol

If you are using Fish4Dogs as treats, have you not considered their foods. I use both the salmon/potato and the cod/potato and am really pleased with the results.

Right, didnt realise they did foods, thought just the treats. Will look into that too. Thank-you!

Just a thought, if you show, they will be at Manchester Champ Show and do some great show offers. It is usually £20 for a 13kg bag so I tend to stock up at shows. They also do a Sardine and Potato foods, but that is aimed at youngsters or veterans, so I have no personal experience.

Oh right, thank-you. I am hoping to show new pup if all goes well but will be popping to a few shows to weigh stuff up before then. Have some problems with lifting (ref: v. old posts) but am hoping grandaughter will be joining me in the show ring. Manchester will be nice and close. Many thanks.

Hi Ann

Just a thought, if you wanted to try Fish4Dogs, if it would help I could let you have a bag of mine as I stocked up on Salmon and Potato at LKA, and can get more at Manchester. I only live about 30 miles away from you, or I could meet you at the Middlebrook Retail Park Horwich, just off the M61 (approx 20 miles from Rochdale).

I know how distressing skin problems are, as my last GSD had terrible problems.

That is so kind. Thank-you. I will check out the local supplier I know price wise first. At the moment she is not biting paws and itchy bottom seems to be easier. Not keeping me or her awake at night. One of my other girls lives with my daughter and she has a recurrent itchy ear! We both ran out of Asda dental chews at the same time and her girl has stopped scratching her ear. Now wondering if that is the problem with my girl. I always give mine one of these when I have to go out. They love them and vet always compliments me on the state of their teeth. I know there are other products that do the same but Asda are so inexpensive. Would be great if we found that they were the only problem though. Will keep you posted. thank-you again for your kind thoughts.

> We both ran out of Asda dental chews at the same time and her girl has stopped scratching her ear. Now wondering if that is the problem with my girl.

Somthing as simple as that can cause the problems. If you keep this out of her diet and she has no further flare ups, then it looks like you have found the cause. To test it & rule out co-incidence, you can re-introduce the chews, it may take a few days of feeding them before any problems show up (depends, may show up immediately).
It would be great if that is the cause, saves lots of messing with her diet
Also worth noting the ingredients of the chews, it may give you a heads-up on possible triggers for her itchy skin.

Will leave another week and then give them half each and see if it has any effect. I do hope so. Would be great to have found the problem so quickly. Thank-you again.

Fingers crossed that it something as simple as this. I may be wrong, but if they are the chews I think, they are predominantly wheat starch, so you may have been on the right track with the wheat intolerance.

Oh I do hope so. Things arent usually so simple, are they!!!! Will keep in touch. x