I am interested in finding out more about papillons can anybody tell me if there are any shows due around the south east area please ? 

Hi, if you visit the Papillon Breed council site http://sites.google.com/site/papillonbreedcouncil/constituent-clubs-1 you will find a list of the 5 Papillon clubs in the UK.

Thanks abbeypaps any thoughts about living with paps ?

Biggest fault with Papillons one is never enough

Easy going little dogs who want to be the first in everything they do.  Only draw back is house training they are the laziest little so and so's if they think they can get away with it.  It has taken me a number of years to reaslise I'M supposed to train them and not the other way round LOL.  I have had GSD's and Border Collies house trained in a matter of days, Papillons have always taken weeks if not a couple of months.  Others may disagree, but I can only say as I have seen both with my own and others.

I have in the past bred and owned Papillons only,  in a group if allowed they can be noisy, I now have the drop eared variety Phalene with one older Papillon and the only one who barks is the Papillon, the Phalenes are very quiet (not always a good thing for people coming around your house or knocking at your door) they do bark and make noise when playing but if it wasn't for the Papillon I would never know there were any starngers around.

Coat care is minimal, I give them a brush and comb at bed time, only thing to watch for is knots behind ears and down the back legs.  Boys can get a wee bit smelly form there urine underneath, but that is easily taken care of with either wet wipes or a spray of fresh water and towel dried.  PRA and Patella luxation are known conditons in the Papillon. PRA less so.  Though I have yet to meet a breeder who has ever bred a dog with either.

To be truthful they could come in pink with green spots, horns and two heads and I would still have them total personality plus dogs with a zest for life and a nose that leads them into all sorts.

I am deffo going to look my closely at them I have only heard good things. Unfortunately I cant have one just yet infact probably a few years away but I do want another toy breed before my next fcr I am also very interested in the spitz klein maybe I will have both !! Must say the one thing a im worried about in either breed is not being noisy, I am really trying to train it out of Mia be nice not to have to worry too much about that again. As for house training its has taken 18months with Mia and strangley happened jusy after she was spayed. You are right about breeds my gsds and fcr took a few days or at least a cpouple of weeks and trainind to one place and a command. The little one just couldn't be bothered
Thanks for the info it is appreciated

I'll check out some of the open shows for you at Ardingly if that is any help with Pap classes?
There is a lovely couple who are judge my breed who have some, they'd be perfect to speak to about the breed in person...

Thank you Suejaw Ardingly would be great to come to its close enough that oh can be dragged along without moaning too much about petrol ! I am only planning for the future but research is half the fun , 

Hi you have the
18th March at Ardingly.. Paps are being judged by Frank Kane..
28th March at Ardingly.. Paps are being judged by Lee Cox
11th April at Ardingly.. Paps are being judged by Mr E Bishop and not before 10.45

That should be a starting point.
There are a number of shows at
Lockmeadow, Maidstone
also some are held in Hants and Surrey..
Not sure where in the SE you are. Ardingly is the closest to me of any show ground..

Thanks thats really helpful, I am in croydon so Ardingly is quite reasonable so is maidstone and surrey.
Thank you I will see if I can get there 18th march would be nice day out as its the day after my birthday

What I like about Papillons is that they are so super energetic. Turbo charged, full speed. Tough and absolutely fearless when brought up properly. But their walks don't need to be very long if you don't have the time (equally they CAN take long walks when you DO have the time) and they love sleeping on your lap. They're like my Malinois but a miniature version. You can do so much with them, they are super for obedience or agility, they learn so quickly. Also very healthy and longlived! And yes very addictive -I was going to have one as a pet 5 years ago, current count is 5! I often say that if I had got one as a first dog (which is what I wanted but it took me over 30 years before I got one as I stumbled into my first breeds by accident) -I'd never have had another breed as they are unbeatable. They can be quite noisy little gits though -especially several together.

Looks like with my future small breed choices (spitz klein and possibly papillons) I may have to move into a field or give the neigbours earplugs. At least gsd and flatti are relatively quiet.
They sound great little characters

Ooh just to throw a spanner in the works, what about Japanese Chins????  very sturdy for a toy/brach breed, and not too overdone on the short muzzle thing.

Ok i'll find some shows at Maidstone and Surrey for you. I'll go back to those ones at Ardingly to see if the Spitz have classes if you are interested in that breed also.

I'm off today to see a litter of Japanese Chin pups.  Saw them at 5 weeks and now off to see them at 8 weeks.  One of my friends is having pick of the boys and will get him at 12 weeks.  They are fantastic wee dogs.

I have met quite a few, I don't do short faced dogs, but I have been really taken by these, both met as pets and at shows.

They seem nice and sturdy too.

oh yes suejaw  that would be good especially to add spitz to my day. Will also look at japanese chins have no idea about them at all. I am similar to you brainless but what I have seen of these I rather like. I also like dogs with fur if you see what I mean hence my long coat gsd. Ok it doesn't do any good for the furnishings especially as I . Their mess is different and I dont expect them to take their shoes off !.
Have just been told by oh , as this plan is my 5 year plan that he was hoping to be down to 1 dog when we retire not increase , oh dear I was planning on 3 !! 
Well they are only small and dont eat much maybe I could smuggle a couple ofo toys in under my coat lol

I dont give up easily

Just found one at Woking Leisure Centre on 18th April
They have Pap and Chin classes, but no Spitz classes there.

There is another show on 20th Feb at Rivermead Leisure Centre, Reading which has Pap, Chin and Klein classes.

The show on 21st Feb at Ardingly has Chin classes but no Spitz, The show on 18th March which you were looking at has Chins and also Klein classes too.

oh thank you sue (is it sue?) you are so kind  looking up these for me and they are all in the sort of area I can get to. How can I find this sort of thing myself or is it a kind of go to one and you find out whats next?. I am spoilt for choice will ahve to do some thinking now thanks . May still be 18th March I assume they are still having paps as that was were we started and I really want to have look at them and chat. Are you going to any of them ?

Hey i may go to the 18th March one, only go to the ones with breed classes on and if not working now.
Sent a PM with the links of the websites i use for shows.

Get a pug!!

First toy breed i have had and im so glad i got one, there so funny and great company, almost not dog like at all! But there a bit like marmite you ether love them or hate them!

my daughter would be delighted if I got a pug , not sure if they are thedog for me though no offense meant

I was very tempted by Paps or Cavs, but hubby wanted an American cocker, so I decided Cavaliers would be a better fit to go with a cocker, a bit bigger and sturdier. But I have a friend with Paps and they are intelligent little things. I've heard they can be yappy, but hers aren't most of the time.

Hi,
Thames Valley Saturday 13th at Montem Leisure Centre, Montem Lane, Slough, Berks. SLI 2QG, have pap's , Chins and spitz classes on.
I'll be there with my pug and bully, so if you fancy this one come and say hello.
Regards Karen

Thanks lollie unfortunately I cant make thissaturday ,bother, would have liked to come as that is still close enough. Any more please let me know I am making note of these and will deffinitely make a couple

Just to say thank you to those who gave me info on papillons. I managed to get to Ardingly to a show on thursday and met some lovely people who have told me lots of lovely things I am certainly quite taken with the breed. All in it was a really good day and I spoke to lots of people with different breeds thank you

Best dogs in the world!-I am of course a little biased

Yes,I agree with that,paps are fantastic little dogs,I've liked the look of the breed for sometime and finally got one nearly 3 years ago and I couldn't imagine life without her,she is so ultra clever,quick and so funny.She does agility but I think she is so wasted not doing heelwork to music as she learns tricks so fast.As I am typing this she is on the floor trying to get my attention by going through her repertoire,she has just dragged one of the cushions off the settee and pulled it over to me and is now rolling on the floor on top of her nylabone kicking her legs in the air as she knows that makes me laugh.She loves her toys and is a crazy tugger.As for being yappy,well yes she can be sometimes but its generally just when she's excited,being trained etc,she doesn't just bark at nothing-and I can cope with that.The only downside with her is that her recalls are rubbish-let her off the lead and she just goes,completely disregarding me,I've worked so hard with them but I wouldn't say they're 100%.I don't know whether thats a papillon trait at all?

The only downside with her is that her recalls are rubbish-let her off the lead and she just goes,completely disregarding me,I've worked so hard with them but I wouldn't say they're 100%.I don't know whether thats a papillon trait at all?

None of mine are like that, they all have really good recalls -but so much hinges on when you start practising. The earlier the better, if they get used to being offlead from an early age it's so much easier. Of course, you get the odd dog out in every breed.

Her recalls are a real problem,she can go from bombing round an agility course to suddenly putting her nose on the ground and sniffing and thats it,you've lost her.She doesn't go competely off the lead on a walk(I have her either on a flexi or a long line) as I can't guarantee I can get her back quickly if another dog approaches so its just not safe.I know that other owners of paps from the same lines have had recall problems as well-thats why I wondered if it was a pap thing-but having said that I've never seen another pap from different lines do what she does.She also scent marks constantly on a walk.
She's had quite a bit of training from a puppy(clicker training ) and everything has been so easy and so much fun to teach her-she's got the brains of a collie-but I've yet to discover how to teach her a reliable recall(and yes I've got the dvd!).

Hi Tuppence is fab on recall so long as I have a ball with me and she will retreive for ever on the field- but I taught this at home that the minute the ball is not immediately retrurned to my hand the game is over. She now only gets the ball outside on walks and other toys at home. TBH i have not tried my younger pup on the field yet but have her a flexi as she is less confident when big dogs approach. I plan to get her off at Easter.

Your girl sounds fun and I agree HTM would be great for Papillons. My daughter have taught my doggy girls so many fun tricks and they love it