Puppy had first vacc. on tuesday at 8 wks old. Limping on wed. Pea sized lump on
ribs thurs. Several large lumps at various places on body on fri. Friday afternoon lumps start bursting.Vet said first lumps were a probable food allergy.
Pup is holding his own at the moment but is very poorly.He is on max dose of 3 antibiotics as still waiting for the result of culture. Anybody with similar experiance out there?

We've had an enormous reaction to vaccination in a pup in the past; the only thing they could do was to put him on antibiotic, and it was four months before he was completely over it. He was awfully miserable. Don't see too much option to vaccinating young puppies, but my other dogs now get blood titres done, and I go by the results of the antibody levels there.

Jo and the Casblaidd Flatcoats

Thanks Jo,I`ve just had results of culture & its clear.Vet said he hasn`t a clue what is going on & he has just done a biopsy. The pup has dozens of abcess`s all over his body but what is coming out is sterile pus.We are desperate to find out what is the matter with him. He is the only one like this out of a litter of 9. If anyone has any experience of anything like this I would be extremely grateful to hear from you. I am at my wit`s end. The little fellow is fairly lively all thing considered!
Many thanks.
P.S. What kind of reactions?

If this is a reaction to vaccine you could speak to Ainsworth homeopathic chemists they do something that can be given for this tel.no.020-7935-5330. If you ring in the morning you maybe able to speak to one of their vets. Hope this helps and your pup is soon better.Gillian

Thans Gillian, will try that in the morning. Could you please check the phone no. as I am in Spain. The thing is we just don`t know at the moment. I would like to know what kind of reaction other pup`s or dogs have had.Have to log off now but will check the board later or in the morning.
Many thanks.

Many thanks Gillian, spoke to ainsworth this morning & they are sending me (?) a remedy for the little fellow. They seem to have no doubt that its a reaction to the vacc.Its being sent express so with a bit of luck it will be here in a couple of days.
They have told me about a group over there called canine census & a women called Catherine Driscoll who have a lot of information about dogs having reactions to the vaccs. I`m going to see if I can find them on the net.
Do you know what puppy head gland is?

Just a thought, It's not Puppy Head Gland is it? It's about the right age.

John

Hi Jhon, whats puppy head? I`ve never heard of it,

That was my immediate thought as well. Sounds very like it.

Joan

Please explain what puppy head gland is.

The Book of the Bitch by J.M Evans & Kay White describes it as follows
"Puppy head gland disease (puppy strangles)
This is a serious staphyloccal infection which may affect one or more of the puppies in the litter from three to twelve weeks of age............ It starts with a few spots or swollen areas, usually on the head, but pregresses very rapidly to swelling of the lymph glands in the neck and grossly enlarged ears, eyes, nose etc, or sometimes the swelling can cover nearly the whole body. The swellings usually turn into abscesses and burst to release their burden of pus. 'The pup was one big abscess', is a comment made by breeders who have experienced this condition.

The basic cause of ... is now thought to be a failure in the pup's immune system or a hypersensitivity to bacteria"

They suggest getting veterinary help without delay.

Just wondered if anyone else reading this also thought that this couodbe caused by the vaccine? As the book does say it is afailure of the immune system,the pup above concerned was only done the day before, and it is the vaccine that the immune system has to cope with so perhaps some pup's systemsdo fail trying to cope with the vaccine. Thus causing the puppy strangles?

However horses get strangles too but I believe in their case it is actually caused by a nasty virulent virus.

I believe the book and info on Catherine Driscoll's findings can be found on the caniine health concern site. Believe it's www.asr-svcs.dircon.co.uk/wwwchc/index.htm

HTH
Lindsay

Hi Lindsay, Ainsworths told me about that site & Ihave ordered the book & it`s onit`s way to me today. It should make interesting reading.
Meanwhile the little fellow is now not eating very well. But he is a little star & a real trooper & if he just holds on till the alternative stuff arrives I think I`ll get him better.

Hi fleetgold Idon`t think he has those symptons.The very first lump was tiny & on his right side over his ribs,later that evening it was gone. The following morninghe had several largish lumps, again over his sides which kept going up & down & moving from place to place. I was in touch with my vet over the phone & he said it sounded like a food allergy. I agreed with him & at this stage the little fellow was fine in himself & eating.It was only on the Friday afternoon that he went quite & the lumps started to burst & we went direct to the vet. Also we have now got the results of the culture back & it is not showing any bacteria. What do you think?

Glad you found Ainsworths useful hope he picks up soon keep us informed.Gillian

For everyone, little fellow is up & walking around the kitchen(only once round) & put his nose in the cat litter!! He has eaten 1 scrambled egg & a spoonful of chicken.Latest from the lab is they have found a bacteria but don`t know which yet. That was early evening. Lets see what tomorrow brings & I`ll let you know.
Thank you everyone. Christine.

Got my fingers crossed for you Christine

Regards, John

Not much new about the little fellow.Another culture has come back clear,the biopsy that was done in the lab at our local hospital has also come back clear & we are still waiting for the results of the other biopsy that was sent to U.K. 3 rather large lumps burst late yesterday afternoon & early evening & he brightened up,ate a fair amount & was cheerful.This morning, however, I could see some small lumps had appeared & as they have become bigger the little chap has gone quiter & quiter. Mind you he has had chicken & rice & fish,so he is getting something down him. By the way he does have a name & it`s 'Get Ready' Reddy for short, but I call him all kinds, little one, sugar puffs, sugar pie, sweetie, in fact anything but his proper name so know doubt he will grow up with complex & I`ll be able to say it`s because of this that he doesn`t have a true sense of who he is!!!!!!!!!!(Joke)
Anyway everybody that`s the latest & I`ll let you know more as & when it happen`s.

Don't worry about the names Christine. "The Flower" started as Anna, got shortened to Annabelle, metamorphosised (?) into Belle Flower which got adapted to "The Flower" And this is supposed to be a working gundog expected to work in mud, water and brambles!

Please keep us posted, we'er all rooting for him.

Regards, John

Thanks John, tell me, has your little "flower" now grown up (metormaphosised)?!!!!!
into a beautiful butterfly with massively, serious identity crisis? If she has it`s all your fault & probably want steak & ribs for the rest of her life to compensate,if not she will sue you for doggie abuse!!!!!!!!!!!

She's now 3 years old, 3 inches too big for a bitch, very much the beautiful Butterfly and brings me Pheases and dummies whenever she finds them! But then, I don't think any of my dogs have ever lasted long without a nickname right from the very first dog! (I have been told that they are all mad though!)

John

John,
Merlin always worked better when I called him .... "Mummies Little Soldier" LOL.

Yes, she's lovely. Only needs a little feathering and to be coloured black/liver, and I'd say she was perfect!!

(Only joking....!)

Jo and the Casblaidd Flatcoats

Hi Christine

Keep us posted, do you think yoiurself it was a link to the vaccine?

Best wishes
Lindsay

Hi everybody, little fellow had his antibiotics changed on Friday evening & by Saturday evening there was a definate improvement & he regained some of his appetite,eating all kinds of tasty things.The lumps had slowed down & were not getting any bigger,I really thought we had cracked it. Sunday was the same, but this morningI saw that several had burst & he is not eating. Some of the other lumps have got bigger, & he is a bit quite.
My first reaction when all this started was that it had been caused by the vacc. now I am not so sure. Nothing makes sense.I still have 5 of his litter mates with me & they are all perfectly healthy, as are my big ones including his sire & dam. By the way, they were all vacc. the same day Thats a total of 9 pups & 6 adult dogs & all are in great shape except him. I`m hoping to get the results back from the biopsy that was sent to U.K. today & also the stuff from Ainsworths, so all I can do is just keep plugging away, coaxing him spending nearly all my time with him & trying to keep him chirpy. I`m up at 6ish in the morning till 1ish the morning & I`m feeling shattered!!!!!!!!! Will let you all know if anything new develops today. A big thank you to you all, for your concern.

The results of the biopsy from U.K. came a couple of hours ago. The little fellow has IDIOPATHIC NODULA PANNICULITIS. As well as the antibiotics he has started on cortisone & vitamin E. The vet says the mortality rate is fairly high & the treatment will be prolonged. I still havn`t recieved the stuff from Ainsworth. Maybe tomorrow?
Does anybody have info on this disease? Mine is pretty scant. I am very hopeful for him as he has a lust for life & a look about him that says I aint goin nowhere yet I`m just "Getting Ready" for the party of life!!!!!
He`s been quite today as a couple of big lumps have burst & he`s not eaten much, but by past experience, he will start to feel chirpy about 11 o clock tonight & I`ll definitely be past my best!
Looking forward to hearing all you opinions & views & knowledge on this disease.
( What about a dirty needle as the cause of infection?)

Hi Christine had a quick look round the internet for info on this but couldn't find that much .maybe you already seen this but this is what I did find http://education.vetmed.vt.edu/Curriculum/VM8764/techcamp/miscskin.html scroll well down the page .Also found this which does suggest that there could be a link with immune system and or vaccination http://www.vetmed.ufl.edu/path/teach/vem5162/panni.htm However it has come about give the little chap a big hug and know that we are all rooting for him. Gillian

GOOD NEWS, little fellow is responding to his treatment. By this afternoon there was a big improvement & a lot of his abcesses had stopped weeping & starting to heal up. He is laying down a lot more comfortably & getting up & down a lot easier.He is going to be O.K.
Late this afternoon I spoke to my vet, there is still no bacteria grown in any of the cultures & he now has no doubt it was caused by the vacc. He has been in touch with the company & explained what happened to Reddy & they told him to leave it with them & they would get back to them before his clinic closed. It was 10 mins before closing time when he was telling me this & they hadn`t got back to him. Right now though I don`t feel able to cope with that side of it as Im just so relieved little fellows on the mend, & I need to get back to some sort of normality.We still have some way to go.
Please let me know what you all think. Thanks.

Don't know what else to say except to reflect everybody else - we're rooting for him.
Love Jo

Hi Gillian thanks for that site, I`ll look it up tomorrow as its a bit late now.I have seen something about this disease but I can`t think for the life of me where . Typical!! I REALLY am very grateful for the support Ive received from you all. I haven`t been out since all this started & being connected to this board has been a massive help. Oh I tell a lie, I`ve been to the vet. Dread to think of the phone bill. Bye for now.

Very glad things are OK now, fingers crossed.
I think vaccinations are probablyoK with most pets, but as with humans some will react. It's pretty horrid when it's yours!

BEst wishes
lindsay

Goodmorning Christine, I've been following this thread with interest and sympathy but not posted as I had nothing to offer you. But now I'd like to say hope the improvement continues, bet you feel two stone lighter, and that we are thinking of you and the little one, keep us posted.

So glad that the little fellow is picking up,but still do keep in touch as we will all want to know when he is fighting fit and doing all the naughty things happy healthy puppies do.Gillian

Good morning everyone,Iposted a message last night but I don`t know where its gone .Anyway, little fellow is improving daily & its lovaly to watch he chased the cat out of the kitchen lasy night & right now he is tossing an empty loo roll round the living room floor. He tires very easily & sleeps for long periods but when he does it is a peaceful sleep, unlike before. Vet rang me on thurs night & told me he had rang the vacc company again & they repeated that they wre looking into it & get back to him, which they havn`t so he has cancelled his contract with them & is going back to his old company.He had only been using this firm since Jan `01.
When I get the name of this firm I shall let you all know. I will keep you all up to date with little ones progress & I would like to say a VERY BIG THANK YOU to everybody, you have amazed me with your knowledge & helpfulness. TTFN.

Hi Christine,

Glad that he is feeling so much better

Leigh

Great news Christine! I've still got my fingers crossed but it's beginning to look as if i'll be able to uncross them soon!!!

Best wishes, John

Wonderful news Christine :D

Yes very good news, so glad thinkgs are looking up Christine.
Do keep us posted.

Best wishes
Lindsay

Hi, like others I have been following this thread, but couldn't think of any way to help. I'm so glad you're baby is getting better. It sounds like his appetite is improving which must be a great relief. I have just remebered when I had a sick puppy who had to have huge doses of AB's and absolutely no appetite that I gave hm B=Sorb, which is a thick green liquid full of vitamins and stuff, it is especially for debilitated animals to get them going/eating again. He would take it off a spoon when he wass refusing even milk. It really does work. Also when he was off the AB's altogether, I gave him Pro=biotics, which reverses what the AB's do to the friendly bacteria needed in the gut, which basically is that AB's wipe them out. Pro-biotics replaces them quickly and easily so that he was able to digest his food properly and kept his appetite up, I'm sure both products helped him enormously. I can't remeber now where I got them, but they were both sold by the same company, I'll try and find out if no-one else knows. I hope he continues to improve. Fingers crossed. WL

Hi everyone, it`s 11 pm my time & when you`ve been up since 6ish am you are hearing your bed calling. I just had to tell you this, little fellow is here in the sitting room wiyh me, running about like nobodys business.Also here with me are 6 adult labs & my little mongrel & she`s about 20kl. The labs are his mum , his grannie, his dad & uncle & aunts. He is going great guns but he still tires easily. I feel fairly confident to tell you all I think he will be O.K. but whether or not he will enjoy a full & healthy life in the future remains to be seen. Right now though he is very vocal & giving the older dogs a hard time!!!! They are all looking at me as if to say hey mum whats going on, why is this little tyke getting away with being so naughty? We cant do that. Also they are fascinated with him & his mum just says he won`t do anything I tell him, you sort him out!Typical! He is now lying down with mum who is giving him some tlc.Now he is recovering he needed to be with the other dogs as he had spent too much time with just me & hubby. Oh, by the way, he has banished the cat from the kitchen.
There is a lot more to say on whats happened to him, but I think that is best left t
o when I am more informed,less tired & in a better frame of mind. For now its just great that he is getting better.
P.S. He is now stretched out fast asleep which is where I am now going.

I am so pleased for you and the little one. I'll keep everything crossed. Do keep us up to date, I'm sure you will

Lots of luck.
Claire.
x

Thank goodness you seem to be getting to the end of your trouble! Give the little fella a big squeeze for me, with all his problems he deserves it.

Regards, John

He's obviously a fighter Christine. So glad he is enjoying himself and getting away with murder.Whats his name by the way?Give him a big hug and get some well earned rest yourself. Best Wishes Gillian

Hi everyone, yes he really is a little fighter isn`t he? A star,& very brave.His name is "Get Ready" reddy, for short but unfortunately I can`t give him any hugs or sqeezes as his little body is still tender & swollen but I get on the floor to play with him & we have loads of kisses & head butting!! Mad or what? He is totally spoilt rotten. I have also started to let him come outside on the terrace with me for
short time but he`s not so sure of himself out there. I suppose it will take time.
Thats all for now, speak to you all soon.