aura my weim will not let me stroke her much as she thinks that i want to play all the time and can get quite rough and bites sometimes hard how can i stop this please help PLEASE CAN SOMEONE ADVISE ME PLEASE

How old is she?

she is a year and a half she is two in december

Has she only started doing this? - or have you only had her a short time?

Denise

I'm no expert but I would try telling her no in a firm voice and totally ignoring her for a while when she does this.When she is calm and allows you to stroke her then lots of CALM praise so as not to exite her.It sounds as if she is very exitable so keep things quiet and try not to encourage her unacceptable behaviour-don't shout at her just be firm and consistant.Make sure everyone else does the same!

You said the man who had her didn't have as much time for her as he would have liked. It sounds like you need to go back to basics and start her training all over again, saying she had any in the first place.
LynnT

Denise I think she's only just got her:)

Stacey x x x

Thanks Kash (for the info),

It sounds to me as though this dog as been left to her own devices for too long, i.e. she feels 'in charge' of herself. Hence even when you wish to stroke her (a friendly gesture) she is making it clear that SHE will decide if you may!

Now I do not like to give too much 'direct' advice to someone who I do not even know, and equally they do not fully know the dog yet themselves (having just got her). More importantly, I do not know how experienced the new Owner is with dogs, so I will hold back on how I would personally respond, and instead suggest that anything that you know the dog does understand, use to your advantage, and start 'throwing YOUR weight around', indicating to the dog that what you say goes, but in a calm, controlled 'don't mess with me' attitude. Do not shout, but state firmly as a command, not a request! Then the moment she responds change from a firm command voice to a soft welcoming tone "What a clever girl". If she sulks (as she may well do, because sadly, she is not used to being told what she can and cannot do) - tell her off, let her realise you will not tolerate that either. Start teaching her new things, (guide her into the correct response and praise her).

Send her out of the room, do not close the door, if she attempts to come in again, tell her "No, outside", and if necessary enforce it. After a while, 'invite' her back into YOUR space, helping her to understand that you as the 'Boss' ALLOW her into YOUR space, which at present she must perceive as a privilege!

By the way do not go 'soft' on her, i.e. I noticed in your Post you said you thought she was trying to play! - Now, I am sure you do not really believe that do you? - otherwise you would not have said her bite can hurt and you would not have 'pleaded' for advice in your Post. 'Playing' does not cause upset, worry and hurt!

May I strongly suggest that you do not use treats, you are not bargaining good behaviour from her, or being 'grateful' afterwards, you must indicate to her that you EXPECT good behaviour and good manners.

With all good wishes,
Denise.

Go on then Denise- my turn now:D I know this has been said so many times but what would you do with a 12 week old GSD pup who nips and chews your arm? I have already looked it up through the search facility but conflicting answers:)

Stacey x x x

Ok, Kash, you asked me direct I will tell you. I would give a very FIRM smack across the muzzle (that is the place the bite is coming from - not the bum)!

However, timing is the key here, the wallop has to make your point, and sadly people give a half hearted smack, afraid it will do untold psycological damage (which it won't - you are NOT beating the dog up for heavens sake), or they do not want to 'hurt the dog's feelings and upset it'! - (even with those we love, we sometimes have to make a point, or if you keep going round the houses, how can we learn 'black from white'. Dogs can end up confused!

Ok, over to timing: the moment he nips, and you wallop with a stern "NO", the wallop should be sufficient for him to immediately drop back with a look that says "blimey, that wasn't pleasant" - you IMMEDIATELY PRAISE him. Yes, I did say PRAISE HIM, but only the very moment he drops back. Then try offering your arm to his mouth, in a very confident manner, as if saying "go on, are you going to try and do it again", he should back off. You praise again. He may well try it again, (just to be sure), but he will VERY quickly learn that jaws and teeth around the 'Boss' (or any person) bring about an unpleasant response, and by praising the very moment he drops back you are letting him understand that NOT mouthing/biting/nipping, brings your pleasure and endorsement that this is the CORRECT response!

You can 'mince about' and take goodness knows how long to solve this, but during that time what is your dog thinking about you! Or you make it clear in just one or two short sharp lessons, and get on with the rest of your lives!

Regards, Denise.

Max still does this @ 20 months (2 in November) - it must be a GSD trait - he thinks its particularly humerous to attach his mouth to your ankle while you are trying to walk around the house ! :rolleyes:

Thanks Denise:)! No offence Banger but I couldn't be doing with her hanging off my ankle at that age and size;) I have been giving her a firm whack on the snout- let me explain *whack*- enough to knock her head to one side- not whacking her so hard she flies across the room and lands against a wall or anything. I just haven't been doing the bit afterwards:) No I'm not ashamed to do it Kass is a complete bugger and together with the size of her- can be a handful:) On occasions though Denise she has came back at me to snap my hand after I've *whacked* her- would you still *whack* her again but maybe slightly harder or what?

Stacey x x x

Hi Kash,

No, I wouldn't get into a 'war' with her. Providing the smack was enough to make her drop back and think "bugger that"! (and it sounds like it was), you have just missed out by not PRAISING HER the moment she dropped back, and then offering your arm etc., and praising again.

Now, if she comes back, (two issues here):- Firstly, I would grab her firmly either side of her neck, bring her towards you and glare at her and say "what do you think your doing - NO". Then plonk her back with the command "Enough", if necessary hold her there for a moment, and if you feel and see a slight relax in her - praise her gently with "Thats better - Enough". Then walk away and CALL HER TO YOU, and of course PRAISE HER, then gently but firmly place your hands round her chest and shoulders and say "Enough" in a quiet soothing voice, then walk away and call her again, repeat as before, and praise her nicely.

Can you see what you are looking to achieve and avoid, you do not want a war with her, but you need to make your point, so you then take control by holding her firmly, then because she is young and can get herself unnecessarily over the top, you then, having made your point, 'change the situation' by walking away and further endorse your control by calling her to you, thus you are then able to praise her, but equally have 'interuppted' the 'over zealous build up' of a strong willed youngster!

The second issue, is the REASON she feels she can come back at you. Look at other areas of your interaction with her. She is obviously feeling somewhat 'above herself' - so get it sorted!!

Regards,
Denise.

Denise I can't thank you enough- I am consistent with it and couldn't work out why it's not working. Like you say I'm lacking the after thought in it all:) As for her coming back at me- she has only done this on a few rare occasions and now that you have me questioning myself with her- I think it's probably down to me not getting my point across to her clearly and she thinks I'm playing either that or on the occasions that she has came back at me I don't even allow her in the same room any longer- I put her back in the utility room with the safety gate closed to show my disgust- I guess she's getting the message I'm disgusted and I'm avoiding the situation rather than curing it:) Thanks Denise for all your help you've been great- I'll let you know how we go on:)

Stacey x x x

Hi Kash,

You'll get there, you are obviously keen to learn, determined to have a well behaved, well adjusted dog, and want to constantly improve your dog's attitude and your relationship - you will.

One small point, start teaching your pup to leave a room (not as a punishment) simply "Kass Outside", and LEAVE THE DOOR OPEN! The dog learns nothing if a door is closed or a gate across - of course he is then contained, but if you achieve this just by your control and he remains on the threshold, waiting to be invited back into the room - that is obedience and authority, which your dog will respect.

All the very best,
Denise.

Denise- just one more;)- then I'll leave you alone- promise;) As she's only a puppy she keeps picking things up and running off with them etc- I do shout 'leave'- but it doesn't seem to have any effect- how do I put this command into action/re-enforce it? I know a lot of people have said why not try the 'giz a paw' first as it's easier but that's a trick isn't it rather than a command and the 'leave' if I can get it would be so useful:)

Stacey x x x

Morning Kash,

Firstly, pups are naturally inquisitive, and lots of things fascinate them, socks, tissue, etc... She wants to investigate and perhaps even consider it a game if you chase her!! - so don't!

But that aside, if it is becoming frustrating with her stealing whatever, then to holler "Leave" once she already has something, is a waste of time.

So to teach "LEAVE-IT" (has a more 'punchy sound' with the IT attached). Have her sitting by your side with her lead on and her half slip collar (part chain for that nice clicky sound when you correct, but with the web collar so as not to harm her neck), have the lead loose, (you must not be holding her back), and you or someone else place something tasty on the floor a little in front of her. The moment she even THINKS of moving forward for that treat, you give a swift check on the lead and the command "No, LEAVE-IT", and as she drops back, you say "there's a good girl". Repeat as necessary. When you can see her think twice about lunging for the treat, praise her warmly, and repeat nicely "Good girl leave-it". Do this daily.

Next sit on the floor in your Living room, with the intention of having a play with her. On the floor with you are her own things, hopefully not too much (dogs do not need loadsa toys - they do not have a 'ToyRus' in the wild). Just a couple of things such as those rope toys, ideal for the dog to sink his teeth and gums into while teething, a Kong, and maybe one of those nylabones. Anyway, you also have a number of YOUR things on the floor too, socks, tissue, (those items she is inclined to nick). Start having a little game with her, she will very quickly be drawn to one of YOUR items, the moment her NOSE even touches it, you say firmly, "NO - LEAVE-IT", and immediately pick up one of HER toys, say the rope, and change your voice into an excited yea whats this tone, and play with her. Then put it down, and continue your game, if she is chasing you, use that to your advantage too by calling "Kass COME, what a clever girl" - learning the RECALL at the same time! Once more as she picks up something of yours, repeat "NO LEAVE-IT", then grab the kong, and "What's this" throw the Kong for her attention and praise and play.....etc....

Occassionally, put something of yours on the floor, and as she approaches it say "Leave-it", if she responds love her to death (not literally, but make sure she knows you are pleased). If she manages to grab it, have her rope in your hand ready (just in case) then call her name, with "what's this", as she turns, chuck it in the air, run around swirling it, so that she comes dashing over to you, give her the rope with a lot of praise.

She is starting to learn that only certain things are hers to touch, and all good things happen with these articles.

Everything is new to her, everything requires you to help her learn and understand with patience and consistency.

By the way, do not apologise for asking me anything, only too happy to help. I will check in a little later on, the weather outside is too good keep me sitting at this screen, (I only intended to check emails)!! I am now off for a dog walk.

Catch up with you later,
Denise.

Kash, it occurred to me did you mean "Give" as well? Have you or are you also teaching GIVE, i.e. when the dog is already holding something, he releases it on that command.

(I read your Post as 'Leave it, don't touch')!

Kind regards,
Denise.

No Denise but it would be a good idea- please;) The hardest thing at the minute is remembering which commands are what- It's so easy to say 'Down' when she's jumping up at the sofa when really I want to use 'down' later on so I keep trying to say 'Off' Confusing at first but I'm getting there:) By the way Denise I really do appreciate all this- thank you:)

Stacey x x x

Stacey

My trainer gave us a list of suggest commands when we joined our training class - i found it a very useful reminder for the first few months - i could email you a copy if you want?

Tracy

If you would please Tracy. That would be great:)

Stacey x x x

Email sent:)

Only left out one Command - NO but I think you have probably got that one sorted! :D

Tracy

Hi Kash,

Well the "Give" is easy: Holding one of her toys, offer it to her and as she takes it in her mouth, you say "Hold, what a clever girl Hold". Then using your index finger on your left hand (or vice versa) lift the flap on the mouth and put your finger into the little gap by the side of their big teeth (kind of in the middle) - and lift to open - real easy just sounds awkard! as the dog's mouth opens a fraction, you say "GIVE" as you remove the toy with your right hand.

Once you have it, you tell the dog how good she's been, and just hand it to her to play (if she wants).

So you are starting to teach her that the command GIVE will mean to release something she is holding. (By praising and handing it back again afterwards, ensures she also learns not to resent you taking it away in the first place).

Kash, you are right to use 'Off'. You will very quickly get used to a variety of commands as second nature. (Problem is you may start talking to kids and adults like it)!!!

Bye for now,
Denise.

Hi Denise, do you have any advice for an older and sneakier thief? Teelin is 18 months and she was a dreadful thief as a pup - anything that she could lift, she stole. Now she restricts her activities to the cats' and other dogs' beds, and only pinches them when we aren't in the room, particularly at night. So far it hasn't come to a row, but this causes aggro from the bedless dogs. She obeys 'Leave' and 'Give' readily and her own bed is comfortable.

Hello Sharon,

Cheeky monkey your Teelin. If you could catch him in the act - great. Unfortunately, this would be difficult, but he may well be doing it quite SOON after you have left the room. So, providing your other dog and cat are not in residence in their beds at the time, perhaps you could have them safely out of the room. Place a sheet of kitchen foil on the bed, dog touches it, it makes that loud crinkly noise, (which may just put him off anyway)!! - It alerts you waiting behind the door, and you dash like the mad person of Borneo and bellow "what do you think your doing, what a bad dog"!

Just one quick outburst, do not go on, or nag, you have surprised him and caught him in the act, now just continue as normal.

Try and repeat some time later, just to be sure.

HOWEVER, why is he doing it? Does he try to boss them about? Perhaps this is one of his tactics - having control of their beds!

You could also interchange their beds, so there is a mixture of various scent on all their beds.

Difficult to be sure on this, because I do not know what else is happening or even not happening!

Hope this is of some help, happy dreams,
Denise.

Thanks Denise. I haven't caught her in the act, though I've tried. I very much doubt that aluminium foil would put this little madame off, but its a great idea as an audible signal and I'll rig something up, maybe in conjunction with the puppy alarm.

Most of the dogs swap beds by day, though they tend to settle in the same places at night. The 'exclusive' beds are Piranha's armchair and two vetbed lined plastic beds used by the shelties. The usual arrangement for the others is Flea in a large vetbed lined plastic bed, Teelin and Megan on a vetbed covered double mattress and Lewis and Cal on a large sofa, again covered with vetbeds. As often as not by morning Teel has piled up all the the vetbeds on 'her side' of the mattress and is perched on top of the heap. Megan and the boys don't mind since they still have a soft bed, but Flea and the shelties get understandably miffed. The cats sleep in a wooden box with hole cut in the side placed on top of a tallish bench and their vetbed is usually 'retrieved' too, though I've no idea how she gets it without a scratched nose.

It could well be a tactic as Teel is quietly and peacefully replacing Cal as pack leader. She never touches is Piranha's vetbed and she doesn't even try to get up on her armchair. That could be significant as Piranha walks at a little distance from the pack, but has always been treated repectfully by the three pack leaders of her lifetime.

Hi Denise, I agree with most of your posting, but it is a weimaraner we are talking about here and you cannot train a weim the same way as you would train a GSD for example.... This is an 18 month old (adult) weim and you cannot force them to do anything..... Shan does not know this dog and the dog doesnt know shan.... they need time to get to know each other. We (In weim rescue) strongly advise new owners not to confront a weim but to use persuasion until the new owner knows the dog a bit better. I would advise shan, when stroking the dog and she starts to bite to immediately stop and move away and do something else, in other words ignore her. The dog has only been in this home a week or so and weims usually take about a month before they settle in and start to trust a new owner, some take longer. By all means use a firm voice when giving instructions but DONT grab the dog, this is asking for trouble, she may have been illtreated and someone grabbing her collar may mean a belting to her so she may bite.... I understand that Shan has 2 very young children and she cannot put the kids at risk by trying to drag the dog out of the room when she is biting....

Shan... the person you got the dog from may not have told you the complete truth as to why they have rehomed the dog and she hasnt been assessed by an experienced weim owner so be careful, dont confront her take things slowly and dont expect miracles, she needs time to settle in and get to know you and your ways, book into some training classes where you can socialise her as well as train her. If she doesnt like being stroked then dont, for the time being, then in time when she is asleep gently gently stoke her, if its her head she doesnt like being touched then stroke somewhere else to start with.... she has to learn to trust you give her time!

Lynn

Weims, a very sensible and common sense ridden post!!! It's good to see it!

Best wishes
Lindsay

I dont know if this will work, i know it usually does with dominant breeds, anyways... for the stroking without snapping and jumping around i would get her to sit and hold a treat in front of her (if she gets up put her back in the sit - be consistant it will work with time) when she is sitting calmly with her attention on the treat stroke her under her chin if she lets you do this without being silly give her the treat and a happy "good girl!!" keep repeating it but move from the chin rub to around the back of her head then down her back, she will associate you patting her with making you happy, her doing the right thing and getting the treat for behaving, after she behaves with you stroking her back/head etc start to not give her the treat and just the "good girl!!" (every now and then give her a treat, but not every time she behaves or she will start to expect the treat, the treat is only a tool to keep her paying attention) I hope this helps, i have no idea if a Wiem is a dominant breed (im guessing they are) also for rough behaviour you could try 'time out' for 15 minutes or so then ignore her for 10 minutes then resume normal activities etc, also having her down stay for 1/2 hr a day does wonders for enforcing yourself as alpha, if she moves put her back exactly where you told her to down stay the first time, she will more than likely get up heaps of times, but be patient and consistant in making her sit stay for the 1/2 hr (even if it is broken a number of times )